City Council — June 2012
June 6–8, 2012
96 posts
Hey, Councillor Moeser is back in council chambers. Glad to hear he's doing better.
Moeser's presence today makes the plastic bag vote look a bit more winnable for Ford. But he's often a wildcard.
Up first at council: renaming the ferry terminal after Jack Layton. I'd like to see discussion on making the terminal less miserable.
"As for policy, I don't think we agreed on any policy," says Ford of Layton.
Hm. Denzil Minnan-Wong and Mike Layton have come to a compromise on the issue of charging charities for solid waste pick-up. Good news.
Trying to figure out why Mike Del Grande abstained on the Layton vote. Maybe this is relevant? https://twitter.com/GraphicMatt/statuses/164044392133427200
Other winners of Bicycle Friendly Community Awards: Guelph! Mississauga! Oakville! Richmond Hill! http://bit.ly/Mk15IB
Not sure what the criteria is. Maybe you get one as long as you don't direct people to purposefully hit cyclists with their cars.
Basically, exec comm recommends killing the plastic bag fee and *also* asking retailers who still charge for bags to donate proceeds.
Quorum call goes out as councillors aren't in their seats. It's almost as if this whole debate over nickels & bags is a waste of time.
"As the uck factor increases, the diversion rate decreases as well," says Councillor Minnan-Wong, noted uck expert.
On most issues I can at least understand the opposing perspective. But these people mad about paying a nickel for bags are simply baffling.
"Would you agree that it's very difficult to pick-up dog waste with a paper bag?" asks Gloria Lindsay Luby in a real debate at City Hall.
Councillor Perruzza has said he'll move an amendment that would ban plastic bags outright. This has caused some freak-outs.
Councillor Shiner says that directing bag fee proceeds to charities means that people will buy more bags just to donate money.
Because people are, apparently, dumb as hell and don't realize you can just give money to charities directly.
"I don't believe these numbers whatsoever," says Doug Ford, being honest for once.
Doug Ford offers to help the city figure out how to recycle more types of plastic bags. Staff are like "Uh, yeah, we're good. Thanks."
Councillor Berardinetti moves a motion that would delete Ford's fee-killing amendment and instead create a "Tree Summit Task Force."
Notably, Councillor Robinson is listed as a member of said task force. Which points to her maybe supporting this motion.
Hey, @CouncillorMB: From NYT, "Seattle Bans Plastic Bags, and Sets a Charge for Paper" - pass on to Gloria. http://nyti.ms/M99Gi3
"Even Italy has banned the bag!" says Councillor Perruzza. EVEN ITALY!
To really appreciate Councillor Perruzza, you have to hear him speak with dramatic background music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLGF4e2aMv4
Councillor Lindsay Luby refuses to believe that Seattle has banned plastic bags because she's been to Seattle.
Apparently Toronto has a vast expanse of plastic bag factories employing huge numbers of people.
Obligatory Mike Del Grande thing: that time this hippie activist tried to ban bottled water on city property. https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2008/pw/bgrd/backgroundfile-17334.pdf (PDF)
By this logic, if we all just used more plastic bags we could reduce unemployment. Yeah, you, with the cloth bag - why do you hate jobs?
Doug Holyday argues we should get rid of the bag fee because it's unenforced and needlessly taking up space in our big book of bylaws.
Councillor Perks is doing that thing where he makes sure councillors *really* understand the wording of their motions. It's a service.
Colle says he's still undecided on keeping the bag fee. Mostly he just sounds annoyed that council is even discussing this.
Pasternak says bag fee makes for a security challenge as people walk out with items not in bags. Contender for worst argument of the day.
Seriously, this speech is awful. "People are looking for less government in this area, not more government."
Perks: "The plastics industry does very very well because bags are 'free.' We don't do so well - because bags aren't free."
Would suggest to @JoshColle that voting to rescind the fee only justifies exec's decision to bring this forward and waste time.
My diet and exercise plan has been pretty effective at making me feel healthier. So now I'm just going to kick back and do whatever.
Vote on referring this whole bag fee thing off to the Solid Waste department fails 11-26. And so we beat on, boats against the current.
Glad other Twitterers are having trouble figuring out what to say about David Shiner's speech.
"Just get rid of the damn bags!" concludes Shiner. And suddenly a full-on plastic bag ban becomes a possible outcome.
For a good time, search for 'plastic' on the Lobbyist Registry. https://www.toronto.ca/city-government/accountability-operations-customer-service/accountability-officers/lobbyist-registrar/search-the-registry-register-as-a-lobbyist/search-the-lobbyist-registry/
Nunziata simultaneously argues that the bag fee is both good and bad for retailers. And also that it's not enforced.
Worth noting, though, that the city has now burned through about $50,000 talking about the damn bag fee.
We are now watching a video wherein a british man poetically narrates the life story of a plastic bag.
Giorgio Mammoliti says he'll say something "shocking" and also speak for the majority of Torontonians: says people simply want free bags.
Giorgio says he gets irritated when cashiers ask him how many bags he'll need for his groceries. Also calls shopping carts "buggies."
( am a bit fascinated by people who call shopping carts 'buggies.' Where's that come from?
Giorgio also says some people can't afford cloth bags. Voice of the poor, this guy.
"The mayor will be the last speaker," says Nunziata. Get fired up.
Here comes Robinson to speak. She's a key vote. She's always a key vote.
Being told that calling shopping carts "buggies" is either a west coast or an Italian thing. Interesting.
Also Thornhill! And Britain. I see no pattern.
RT @ddale8
@GraphicMatt My Thornhill mom always called it a buggy.
Robinson's support for maintaing the fee may close the book on this one. Her vote + Colle + Lee would do it, by my count.
Ford credits Lindsay Luby for "all her hard work" on this issue. I am not sure how work is involved in this.
"[The bag fee] has really irritated people," says Ford. Makes half-hearted libertarian-ish appeal. No real passion from the mayor.
Ford: "I do not support banning plastic bags. I think plastic bags are useful. They come in handy for a number of things."
22-22 vote on deleting recommendation to kill the tax. Geez. Colle and Bailão went with the Fords. http://twitpic.com/9tj6ij
Perruzza's motion to ban plastic bags outright in 2014 loses on a tie, too. Different vote breakdown, though. http://twitpic.com/9tj7io
Council just voted to ban plastic bags next year. This is what it looks like when something blows up in Ford's face. http://twitpic.com/9tj7x6
To be clear: no plastic bags at all starting next year. This is the exact opposite of what Rob Ford intended. Wow.
Staff are probably going to go nuts trying to figure out how to implement this on such a short timeline.
Most surprising "yes" vote: Gary Crawford.
Matlow, who voted against Shiner's bag ban, wants the vote re-opened so he can go on the record as supporting it, I think.
Hope this is part of a trend. Ford attempts to repeal the Land Transfer Tax = DOUBLE Land Transfer Tax.
Nunziata, editorializing: "We probably will go to court, so be prepared to pay a lot of legal fees."
I like to think this all started when @gordperks reminded David Shiner about his longhair rebellious days.
If you're looking for me next year, find me driving around town selling people black market plastic bags out of my trunk. For 25 cents.
Rob Ford will now spend the rest of the night at a 24-hour Sobeys talking to shoppers about their plastic bags.
Weirdly, depending on how the rest of this motion goes, we could go back to free plastic bags for a six month period between July and Jan.
The problem right-wing councillors have is that they have just two choices: supporting existing bag fee or supporting ban of bags.
Meanwhile, at City Hall, everything has fallen to pieces and no one knows what to do.
And to think: All @CouncillorMB wanted to do was direct a little money toward the tree canopy.
Nunziata calls a five minute recess. But not the good kind of recess.
"Get away - this mic is live. *muffling sound*." Don't worry, guys, we didn't really hear anything interesting.
Ford should try to cut council in half next. It'd be cool to have 88 councillors.
Pointing out that banning bags like this might be a bad idea is a bit like pointing out continuity errors near the climax of a good movie.
Okay, so council killed the bag fee as of July 1. Just to make scoring this a pain in the ass. http://twitpic.com/9tjnau
The city has banned the sale of items in the past, right? Pesticides and such? I'm not sure why there'd be a legal issue with the bag ban.
That said, and now that the funny movie is over, I do agree that going into this with no study, consultation or plan is worrisome.
Quite the line-up on Goldhawk tonight: Berardinetti, Perruzza, Carroll and Shiner.
Carroll says she thinks there's more work to be done on implementation of bag ban. City solicitor will have some thoughts, etc. Yeah.
Shiner wants TO be like Seattle: no plastic bags, free small paper bags, five cents for large paper bags with handles.
First caller to Goldhawk: likes convenience of plastic bags and worries that cloth bags spread bed bugs and such.
Shiner says it was like a "vision that came down from the sky" when he looked at other cities banning plastic bags.
Caller has used reusable bags for a long time. "The fact is, I haven't died from any kind of grocery-related disease."
Things have gotten so weird that I think @shelleycarroll is actually the most right-wing person on this Goldhawk panel tonight.
David Shiner just did his Mel Lastman impression. This is quite a day for him.
I've always wanted to carry home a bunch of groceries in a single large paper bag with a baguette sticking out the top. Like a movie.
Meanwhile, at City Council, Doug Ford is taking shots at @AdamCF. "That guy, as far as I'm concerned, is a little snake."
He also referred to him as a union lobbyist. Item up for debate relates to new appointment to the library board.
Only half paying attention, but I support #TOCouncil's bid to bring back the Montreal Expos.
"Feel my pain! Feel my pain!" says Councillor McMahon. Friday sessions are weird.